User comments btil June 2003

[a_ciel]

M6 ttl BODIES: .58, .72 OR .85?

I'm about to purchase my first Leica and have settled on the M6 ttl.

My decision comes about after a year of going back and forth and being a bit put off by reverse photo snobs (who sneer at anyone that would think of spending that much money on a camera, "when Nikons are just as good"). I've got my reasons for going with Leica. It's enough to say I think it's the tool that's right for me.

A big question I have, though, is which viewfinder magnification to select. Most often I'd use a 50 mm lens and sometimes a 35mm. I've found a very good .85 (I know it's more prone to flare), and I like the bigger frame lines for a 50mm. With a 33mm on this body, I know the framelines are out to the edge - no anticipating what's moving into the frame. Of course, I'd sacrifice the 28mm lines.

Does anyone have advice to offer on picking viewfinder magnification? Keep in mind also that I wear glasses. I've looked at the .72 (and might buy that magnification, but they've become very hard to find). With the .58 I'm not sure if I'd like the relatively small framelines (the one's for the 50 seem awfully small). But I know the .58 is primarily designed for wide angle.

Does anyone in this forum who wears eyeglasses also use a .85 - most people seem to think it's bad for someone like myself who has to wear them.

 

[marco]

Hi Bryan;

I've used all three mags you mention on the M6 TTL bodies (none of which I own anymore). I'm currently on an M3 (0.91x) and have an MP (0.72x) on order. My main lens is the 50mm.

I wear glasses or contact lenses, depending on whatever I feel like that day. The M3 is wonderful with a 50mm & contacts, not so great when I use glasses. Hence, the reason for buying a new MP in 0.72x - for 50mm plus glasses.

IMHO, if 50mm is your main lens, with an occassional use of a 35mm, PLUS you wear glasses, then the 0.72x is probably your best bet. Here's more detail -

- the 0.85x or the 0.91x (M3) on 50mm with glasses(at least the glasses I wear) does not allow me to see the entire frame. The 0.72x for the 50mm with glasses is better, allowing me to see the entire 50mm frame plus a bit beyond.

- the 0.85x or the 0.91x on 50mm with contact lenses or without glasses is fantastic. Probably the best camera you can place behind a 50mm lens. This is esp. true of the M3, as its rangefinder patch is flare free (yup, I experienced flare on the 0.85x M6TTL).

- the 0.85x with a 35mm lens plus glasses: there's no way I could see then entire 35mm frame.

- the 0.58x is wonderful with a 35mm lens & glasses, if that's your main lens. However, I agree with you that the 50mm frame is getting small. You may find it frustrating if 50mm is your main lens, as I did.

So I would say if 50mm is your main lens and you wear glasses, go with the 0.72x.

 

[asand]

>Hi Bryan, > >I wear glasses and use the .72 M6TTL for a 35, a 90, and less often a >50. I wouldn't want any higher mag. With a 35 mounted I feel like I'm >smashing the camera into my glasses to be able to _barely_ see all the >framelines. With the .85 I'd have to move my head and roll my eye all >around to see the entire 35mm frame...not at all conducive to quick >work. I played with the .58 and liked being able to see all the >framelines easily, but, like you, I felt that it was too small to use with >longer lenses. > >There still seem to be plenty of minty .72 TTLs for sale used...you could >check on photo.net. I'd expect to pay around US$1200 for one that you >can't tell has been used. > >Hope that helps a little, >Aaron

 

[a_ciel]

Macro & Aaron,

Thanks for your helpful feedback about viewfinder mag. on the Leica M6. After reading your posts, I was able to find several .72 bodies and compare them side by side w/.58 and .85 (you guys were right...the .72 is the best option considering the eyeglasses factor and using a 50mm summicron most of the time). I haven't bought one yet but plan to this week.

I visited the the Leica Gallery in NYC and got a list of authorized dealers from them. Many of the places recommended are small camera shops where the salespeople are the owners and are NOT trying to close the deal and move on the next sale. They take their time with you and really explain the cameras and lenses.

Question about "Demo" cameras (still in the platic bag). I looked at one M6 TTL .72 in this category - in fact the only Leica I've ever seen in plastic - and it still has a one year warranty under Leica ($1,450), which is really more than I want to pay. The other downside is that it's never been used and has probably been in plastic for a while. Maybe this one belongs in the collector's domain. I'm wondering if I should liberate it if the price is right or avoid it.

I'm not really looking for a pristine camera (I've heard that if a camera just sits around unused that it's bad for the mechanics). Oh well, as picky as I am, I should probably buy a slightly dinged Leica. At least I won't be so hard on myself when I put my own scratches on it.

Macro...by the way, I came across an M3 for $899. I have to admit that it's an appealing camera. I love the retro look. And it doesn't have that red dot (yelling Leica).

 

[asand]

>Bryan,

You're welcome!

The M3 has a very high magnification finder (.93, I think), so would be even harder to use with glasses than the .85 M6TTL. Other models such as the M2 and M4's have the .72, so might be worth a look. (I have an M2 and love it, although you have to check the viewfinder for signs of separation before buying an M2.)

For buying used Leica stuff, I follow the "35mm non-SLR" classified ads on www.photo.net. A "like new" M6TTL .72 sold there a couple of days ago for $1150, but it seems like the going rate is closer to $1200-1250 for one you can't tell has ever been used. Of course, then you might have to make a point of dinging it yourself a couple of times in order to feel comfortable really using it! As long as you check out the seller, get their address/phone number, verify it, speak on the phone, etc, etc, you should be safe.

Good luck!

 

[wlafferty]

> [...Brian wrote:

Does anyone in this forum who wears eyeglasses also use a .85 - most people seem to think it's bad for someone like myself who has to wear them.

Brian,

I wear eyeglasses and have an .85 M6 TTL. I use it with the 50mm and 90 mm lenses. I do not have a wide angle lens, so I cannot tell you how that is, but I like the 50 and 90 combination. It seems to me that I get more precision of focusing than with the .72.

I suspect that which viewfinder suits you is pretty much a matter of personal preference, i.e., which lenses you use most and how the image looks to you. I am only writing to say that at least one person who wears glasses uses the .85 and likes it.

Bill Lafferty Pittsburgh ] >

 

[a_ciel]

For the sake of argument, I'd like to ask anyone how bad the flare problem is with a .85 M6. Is this an overstated issue or a true problem for shooters? Having looked at these cameras in the shops, of course, I have no ability to test this.

 

[colorado_jeff]

I'm confused about the "flare" I keep hearing about with the .85 viewfinder. What the heck are you all talking about?
Jeff in Colorado

 

[Craig24]

Erwin Puts on his site has an updated article which will answer all the technical questions relating to RF patch flare in the all M cameras.

For the time being. It is only a problem whith strong oblique light. The RF patch is "blinded" and you can't focus.

regards craig

 

[mattinasi]

> For the sake of argument, I'd like to ask anyone how bad the flare > problem is with a .85 M6. Is this an overstated issue or a true > problem for shooters?

I had a .85 M6 'classic' and used it for several years. There was the occasional rangefinder flare, but it was not a big deal. Simply repositioning the eye a bit alleviates the flare, and then I eventually added a device called the 'shade' that eliminated it entirely. The 'shade' cost about $5.00, but I have heard that a piece of Scotch tape over the rangefinder illumination works equally well, for a small fraction of the cost.

The flare problem is terribly overrated! It happens very seldom, and is so easy to avoid (reposition the eye or use the tape / shade). BTW: my new M7 with 0.72 finder has the same thing, equally rare and equally easy to avoid or overcome.

The .85 magnification was very nice for 90mm work - I miss it when I mount that lens. Next M will be an 85, for sure. With the 50mm it is really nice too.

- marc