Do photographers posting here want honest feedback, or not?

[andysalay]

Hello folks, this is my first post here.
I think there are many wise and mature opinions here.

I identify myself especially with these:

Stig - I think Danny has answered in the way I would have, i.e. people post for fun because it's a hobby and this is a community, and not everyone is necessarily looking for a critique of their work. They probably just want to participate. There will be many who are at various levels of ability from beginner to pro so a harsh critique may well put the beginners off and then they stop posting. DPR had challenges which I think were a fair place for competition and critique among the best shots.

It's hard isn't it. I guess there's sides to this. On one hand, if you're posting stuff on a public forum, you should expect, and accept, that you're going to get responses that could be useful, not useful, or perceived as abusive/aggressive. That can often just be the nature of remote discussion (often forgetting the power of body language in conversation, and that needs to be conveyed into a text only medium).

For me, like some here, I am a hobbyist, and over many years of taking and editing photos, come to my own conclusions as to what I'm happy with as a final result. Generally I prefer to portray an representation of the original scene I saw, so critique by someone else is pointless, unless they were there with me.

However, in the spirit of using such a discussion community, I'd certainly not be offended by anyone critiquing any images I post. If I was, I simply wouldn't bother posting any images at all.

But, perhaps the simplest answer is to just have a specific subgroup for that, then you know exactly where you stand with it. Although from all I've seen, it's hard to stop critique appearing anywhere an image is posted. Perhaps a good start is just to use a C&C flag in the posting to show whether it's welcome or not.

There probably isn't a correct answer, but I agree with a previous response, there are too many snowflakes out there. You can always simply ignore C&C if you don't want it.

As you say though, let's just have fun, and enjoy it if it's a hobby, and good fortune to you if it's a profession.

Cheers
Andy H
(DPR refugee)

But we are getting better much quicker with the help of the others, and somebody only with the help of the others, so for me, when I decide to post, I am ready to receive critique. Everybody should be grateful for the efforts to help, regardless of the form, and we should be mature enough to withstand also these not very cautious words.

Maybe it would be beneficial to have two subgroups, according to critique anticipation or not.

And my two cents:
Consider this situation: sometimes people are using not the best equipment, and it is obvious from the technical quality of the photo. And the author knows that problem very well already, and also the solution (to these technical problems), but for now he just wants to use what he owns, therefore he is not interested in this kind of critique. Or this could be some other aspect of photography, too.

In such circumstances it would be beneficial to offer to OP some kind of simple checklist, where he could check, on what aspects of his photo he is awaiting opinions.
For example:
[ x ] Artistic aspects
[ x ] Technical quality
...

Each main group could also be expandable, if there is a need to specify aspects more precisely:
[ x ] Artistic aspects
|__ [ x ] Composition
|__ [ ] Contrast & Tonality
|__ [ x ] Light
...

There are many aspects, some more generic and some too specific, but real photographers and "critiquers" can brainstorm actual content.
(I do not consider myself as such.)

And I thank everybody for their work on making replacement platform for DPR, and especially for saving excellent useful content.

Regards,
Andy Salay

 

[Lee Jay]

But we are getting better much quicker with the help of the others, and somebody only with the help of the others, so for me, when I decide to post, I am ready to receive critique.

You really think so? I can't remember a time when an esthetic critique of one of my photos taught me anything. It's very common for me to like what others don't and for me to hate what others love. In the DPReview Challenge of Challenge winners, there were several I would have deleted in-camera. Such is the nature of purely subjective endeavors. Once in a while someone will notice a small detail in one of my photos that I didn't even see, and find it distracting, and I suppose that's helpful (since I didn't see it). I just have a really hard time learning what I will like from others. I learn it by doing it myself.

 

[andysalay]

Of course every rule has an exception.
I learn (at least I think that I am able to learn) from looking at others' photos, too, and asking myself why I like (or not) that particular photo.
But, at least the very beginners can profit also from esthetic critique, albeit it is a matter of taste.
The example is overdone artificial HDR, which I hate and find unnatural and annoying. Somebody will take other's opininon, somebody not.
But if one does not want any other opinions, the explicit statement about that or posting in apropriate subforum or subsection can save others' efforts.

 

[Schrodingers cat]

Do people posting images here want honest feedback? Or is this more for "social sharing?"

While I certainly can't speak for anyone other than myself, I personally would appreciate criticism directed to potential ways to improve my work. If I disagree with the criticism there
is certainly nothing to keep me from saying thanx and moving on.

Having said that, I have observed several circumstances where criticism may not be helpful even when intended that way.

• My standards may not be theirs. If an image meets the criteria I have established for myself and that results in work which in general is not pleasing to the observer that can be an issue. For instance, if I like HDR and highly saturated images while the viewer does not appreciate HDR in general and prefers more realistically presented colors, that's probably not going to work out.
• If my artistic intent has not been made clear it's difficult for random strangers to comment on ways I might consider better achieving that intent.
• If the observer has not demonstrated any degree of expertise or displayed images of their own, their criticism may be difficult to accept as having validity.
• If the criticism is presented as universal facts rather than an opinion based on the observer's personal preferences and experience that probably doesn't go over well with many.

While I'm perfectly happy with having someone negatively criticize my own work I agree that there should be some understanding of who feels the way I feel about it and who just wishes to post without comment.

For my own part, I only post criticism's when they are requested, and feel more comfortable linking to my own work so the artist can decide for himself whether my opinion has any value.

 

[nzmacro]

Yes I think there could well be a want for a critique board. Maybe have it set for only 1 image every two to three days or something like that, because there's no point in someone posting up 5-10 image's and asking "What's wrong with these" It might be worth it if enough people use it and if not, delete it. Just in my opinion anyway. That's Dirks call though for sure.

Danny.

 

[jeffj3]

What's the point of seeking someone else's entirely subjective opinion of an entirely subjective endeavor?

The only opinion that matters is that of the person for whom the picture is taken which, in my case, is usually me.

If I prepare a meal for myself, why would I care if you like it or not? Further, if I prepare a meal for a customer, why would I care if anyone but the customer likes it?

Love the analogy of the meal. Well said.

 

[archer]

Yes I think there could well be a want for a critique board. Maybe have it set for only 1 image every two to three days or something like that, because there's no point in someone posting up 5-10 image's and asking "What's wrong with these" It might be worth it if enough people use it and if not, delete it. Just in my opinion anyway. That's Dirks call though for sure.

Danny.

There is a forum for critiques called Samples and Galleries

 

[Schrodingers cat]

While I certainly can't speak for anyone other than myself, I personally would appreciate criticism directed to potential ways to improve my work. If I disagree with the criticism there
is certainly nothing to keep me from saying thanx and moving on.

Having said that, I have observed several circumstances where criticism may not be helpful even when intended that way.

• My standards may not be theirs. If an image meets the criteria I have established for myself and that results in work which in general is not pleasing to the observer that can be an issue. For instance, if I like HDR and highly saturated images while the viewer does not appreciate HDR in general and prefers more realistically presented colors, that's probably not going to work out.
• If my artistic intent has not been made clear it's difficult for random strangers to comment on ways I might consider better achieving that intent.
• If the observer has not demonstrated any degree of expertise or displayed images of their own, their criticism may be difficult to accept as having validity.
• If the criticism is presented as universal facts rather than an opinion based on the observer's personal preferences and experience that probably doesn't go over well with many.

While I'm perfectly happy with having someone negatively criticize my own work I agree that there should be some understanding of who feels the way I feel about it and who just wishes to post without comment.

For my own part, I only post criticism's when they are requested, and feel more comfortable linking to my own work so the artist can decide for himself whether my opinion has any value.

Too late to edit my previous post and at the risk of repeating myself ......
I recalled my mother getting on to me over something I had said. She told me "It's not what you said but how you said it." I rather suspect that this may be an occasional occurrence with photo critiques as well. Simply being correct is not sufficient, the critique also has to be worded in such a manner that it will actually be considered. Speaking for myself, I think that may be difficult sometimes.

 

[MNE9476]

Then what is the point of posting an image, if not for all to see and possibly critique. Anyone who does not want any C&C should have a special asterisk next to their name indicating they are a snowflake, nést pas?

Stig, I really look forward to seeing some of your extremely wonderful photos. I was really hoping that we could leave some of these kinds of attitudes behind on DPReview.

Some people just like to share images they took just because they enjoy photography. Most here are not professionals. If they ask for C&C, they will get it and hopefully in a respectful manner.

 

[Schrodingers cat]

There is a forum for critiques called Samples and Galleries

Thank you for calling that to my attention. I'm going to try it out right now