Does size matters? - What is the best system for you?

[dirk]

Although I agree to most of the points, IBIS only helps, if you have non-moving subjects.

But there are also other advantages of bigger sensors. The bigger the sensor is the better the image is looking with the same amount of pixel. No matter at which ISO. I would love to have a Hasselblad X1Dmini with only 16MP or 24MP but the same sensor size than the X1D with its 50MP.

DOF will be in the future no differentiation anymore between sensor sizes IMHO. If you look at what smartphones can already achieve with background blurring only with software (Google Pixel 2 for example), you realize that it is only a question of time, when this will be ready and even better implemented for real cameras.

 

[ilkka]

Size matters ore not, when i started whit Nikon full frame cameras i have not looked back. So maybe the size matters, never given any thought about it anyway. I usually change camera body in two ore three years because they get lot of beating from my work as freelance. I usually buy the latest model because they are sturdy and fast. My work is most press and feature!

 

[David Sw]

...coal mine... Cole would agree.

 

[foveonfan]

Hi!

I have just bought a new Canon 6D. Could not resist the bargain price resulting from it being superseded by the 6DII. Before this, Idid all my work with Sigma's Foveon tech. My current Sigma SD1 is great for my landscapes. In other words, anything that does not move. But since gaining an interest in bird photography, the SD1 began to show its weakness, slow and inaccurate AF. Manual focus is not one of my strong skills anymore as my eyes get older and older. This meant many lost opportunities with the quick as lightening little creatures I so sorely wished to hang on my wall.

Enter the 6D. Careful use of the central or spot AF mode has seen my lost opportunities vanish.

But that is not what this thread is about. We're really discussing whether the size of sensors matters. My experience tells me yes and no. Many factors to consider. How big do you wish to print, etc. My SD1 might have a APS-C sized sensor, but boy can that sensor render detail, with only 15 mp spatial locations and I've many AO+ sized prints to prove it. I'm confident that there will be many landscapes opportunities in my future that will find me preferring the SD1 out of my pack instead of the 6D.

But after all is said and done, your personal taste and choice may vary from that and I respect that.

Sincerest regards, Jim Roelofs

 

[dirk]

I do think the Foveon sensor is very special in this regard and not comparable with other sensor independencies between sensor sizes. The Sigma Merrill sensor is competing with the Nikon D800 sensor at basic ISO settings although it is only APS-C size and even then my D800 could often not match the clarity and 3-D effect of the Merrill images. So this would be unfair to compare

 

[foveonfan]

It's not until you've witnessed some large prints (AO+) that you begin to appreciate what this supposedly lightweight APS-C sized sensor in the SD1-M is capable of. It's not possible to post this image (even at 100dpi) here. The best I can offer is the address at my portfolio site. 162621766.IOwVwZG7.jpg Select "original" viewing size and you'll begin to see what I mean.

Sincerest regards, Jim Roelofs

I sincerely hope this is not inappropriate, Dirk, as I have not intended to offend you in any way.

 

[dirk]

It's not until you've witnessed some large prints (AO+) that you begin to appreciate what this supposedly lightweight APS-C sized sensor in the SD1-M is capable of. It's not possible to post this image (even at 100dpi) here. The best I can offer is the address at my portfolio site. 162621766.IOwVwZG7.jpg Select "original" viewing size and you'll begin to see what I mean.

Sincerest regards, Jim Roelofs

I sincerely hope this is not inappropriate, Dirk, as I have not intended to offend you in any way.

Hi,

do not worry, there is nothing inappropriate in your posting. We do have nothing against posting a link to a supersized image. But most users do want to see additionally the image in a nomal viewing size within that posting to know beforehand what kind of image they can expect. you can not discuss images, if you do not see them in the thread themselves.

I know that many Sigma users started with the introduction of the Merrill Foveon sensor generation to argue, that the benefits of Merrill sesnor can only be seen at full resolution. I strongly disagree. The same aruement can be made with Nikon D800 files or Hasselblad medium format files. Of course it is always better, to see it as big as possible. THis is why you should add a link to the original file.

But at 1000 pixel on the longest side (not dpi), an image is big enough to see the advantages in a thread. I can see it even at 600 pixel, if the postprocessing is done correctly.

Just try it out. Upload a Foveon image with 1000pixel on the longest side in the "having fun with Sigma" thread and put under it a link to the original file.

The image you linked in the posting above, is only 100x160 pixel by the way. So way too small...

 

[afshalders]

Again and again, it depends if we're talking about prints or screen. The human eye sight limit is something like 300 dpi viewed from a distance of 15-20 cm. Any resolution beyond this and you're wasting information, and this is a well proven fact. For larger prints, we need lower dpi. Nobody looks at a 30x60 print from 15cm unless for pixel peeping.

There are many calculators that helps to choose the proper resolution x size x distance.

To be honest, if I ever need an A0 size high quality print, I'll do something far more logical, at leat to me: Use a medium format camera and do a high quality scan. No digital camera beats a 6x6 or 6x9 low grain film scanned at 3600+ dpi

Talking about Sigma, I'm using their cameras since the advent of the SD9. Still have a SD10, SD15,DP2, DP2-M and SD-1M and Foveon images can be easily upscaled to 150% with very little loss in image quality. Just choose the right algorithm like Lanczos with an 8x8 matrix or Mitchell-Netravali. The lack of color alias is one of the reasons that makes this possible. Even at 200% enlargements the results are better than with Bayer or X-Trans sensors.

Higher sensor resolutions like 20-30 megapixels sounds good on paper BUT sometimes you get a bad deal, for example in the form of noise or optics limitation due astigmatism and diffraction. Some lenses I have are excellent on my SD14 and really sucks with the SD1.

And, of course, the post processing makes a huge difference, specially if using raw. I'll not dig deep into this subject. =)

But the best way is to check by ourselves the final result using our eyes. If you like it, don't care about what other people are saying.

 

[noisycheese]

In a nutshell: Sensor size doesn't matter much if all you ever do with your images is email them or post them online.

If you want to make large exhibit quality prints, sensor size does matter.

My camera has a 24x36mm 24mp sensor. I can print to 16x24 inches and still have very high image quality in my prints. I suspect that I could go larger and still have the level of I/Q that I want in my prints, but haven't made larger test prints yet.

 

[fotografz]

Hi Dirk, it has been a while. In my experience, sensor size makes a difference. Sensor technology also makes a difference. It has more to do with Image Qualities than Image Quality ... there is a difference. The Image Qualities of a photo are more of an aesthetic measure and subsequently can be quite subjective. Image Quality is the more discussed measure because it can be quantified more easily ... but they do not necessarily mean the Image Qualities produced will meet a person's aesthetic criteria.

In my opinion, the selection of camera, sensor type, lenses, software ... and level of skill using them in concert ... all contribute to arriving at the look and feel you want from your images.

I currently use a 37 meg Leica S(008), a 43 meg Sony A7R-II, and an 18 meg Leica M Monochrome. Despite using Zeiss Batis lenses on the higher meg Sony I am not fond of the images it produces in comparison to the other cameras. I do not use a crop sensor because of DOF choices and the fact I crop images a lot.